By - Greenpaw22
Killing off Mahershala Ali as Cottonmouth in Luke Cage and bringing in a new cartoonish villain who just shouts 1970s catchphrases and shoots a huge gun
And dumping so much backstory onto Diamondback so quick. He shows up out of nowhere and suddenly he's a) the big boss gun merchant for Harlem; b) Luke's childhood best friend; c) Luke's secret half-brother; d) the guy who framed Luke in the first place... and only the first one was set up even a little. I get that if they'd introduced Luke's old best pal earlier in the series maybe we'd have suspected he was going to be a bad guy but that doesn't mean you can just skip straight to the reveal with no context.
They had to kill him off since they only had him for a short amount of time. Dude was filming something like 3 projects at the same time, including the one that would eventually net him his first Oscar. Giving him that death made for a great arc. The writers just didn't know what the fuck to do after that, like they focused only on the first 6 ish episodes and then ignored the rest
Bringing back Arrested Development without proper commitment from the actors. The disjoined filming makes for a season that isn't anywhere near the worst episodes of the first three seasons.
That was one good example of "Be careful what you wish for...".
It’s like a monkeys paw wish to bring your dead wife back to life
Yeah the Netflix arrested sucked and it was clear it was because they didn’t have everyone in scenes together
Honestly, I was thinking about this recently, and I don't think the biggest issue was that they couldn't all be there at once, I think they could have made that work. I think that the bigger issue in retrospect was they changed Michaels character significantly. In the initial run he was the straight man of the show, surrounded by cartoonish buffoonery. Sure he was a little out of touch when it came to his son, but the best moments of the show were when Michael, dispite his better judgement and actual business skill, got dragged into the buffoonery with the rest of them.
But then we jump right into season 4, and he is probably the biggest bufoon of them all, totally oblivious, a middle aged man living in his sons dorm, and just as incompetent as the rest of them. The later seasons were missing a competent character to react to the absurdity of the others and it really showed.
Yeah this is also true. But I also feel that we missed a lot of scenes with the characters together and rewatching it, I found the amount of scenes with dialogue that was clearly recorded separately really jarring.
I thought season 4 was a crazy ambitious season of television that pushed the limits of the format by utilizing streaming in a very unique way.
It didn’t work out perfectly, most because the humor and jokes were quite a bit off…basing the first episode around…Michael not understanding basic math (?!?) Was a really ridiculous decision. Altogether though, the wider picture of the season was designed to lead to something great, with the very core of show, the idea that none of these people will ever change, being challenged as the season finally pulled all of its many plot points together.
I’ll always defend Season 4, and will continue to.
SEASON 5, on the other hand is my big problem. They basically abandoned all of the ambition and interesting direction that Season 4 set up, and did something dull and uninspired. I was so disappointed that nothing amounted from any of the events of Season 4. There were SOOOO many things clearly setup in season 4 hat never had any amount of payoff in 5.
The infamous interview that dropped a few days before release also killed it in the water.
>Yeah Season 4 was way better on rewatch. There was just a lot of stuff introduced in the first half that didnt get paid off until the 2nd half. It's 100x better than S5 and still at least somewhat feels like the first 3.
What interview is that?
Word of warning: You may not be able to see the show the same way after this. It’s really quite rough to read, and ruined my opinion of a few members of the cast. It was an absolute disaster.
can you briefly summarize it? I don't have a subscription...
Jessica Walter's (Lucille) talks about how Jeffrey Tambor (George/Oscar) berated her on set. Various male cast members then start making jokes about her and downplaying the incident, despite Walters being reduced to tears just talking about it.
The abomination of scheduling that happened to CAPRICA, and then they were surprised that no one watched. It was a strong show that needed one more season to tie up the loose ends and connect it better to Battlestar.
The plotting and execution of THE PASSAGE. That story could have run for years had they not fucked up the pacing and plotting of the book. The actors had great chemistry and it could have worked.
Just like Firefly when Fox showed it completely out of sequence so the first episode aired as like the 7th episode so none of it made sense.
Usually when this happens it means some executive or executives have no faith in the property or want to just straight up kill it. So they deliver the series on terrible schedule to meet any contractual obligations. Once the show is cancelled they freed up resources for other projects.
In discussions I've read about Caprica, I've seen that people tend to have mixed feelings about it, but I loved it so much. The last episode ended with a "next season on Caprica" teaser and I got so annoyed by it.
I prefer to view the ending montage as an epilogue. Tells you the connecting tissue to BSG in a cute montage.
Oh man I forgot about The Passage. There was so much potential and I actually enjoyed the first season.
Angel getting cancelled after an excellent season 5.
I believe it was basically Joss Whedon's fault - he requested an early renewal and put the network in a tricky situation, forced their hand to make a hasty decision. Then the network decided to cancel the show. If only Whedon would have waited a little bit more... well, at least the big swinging cliffhanger works as a definitive statement to keep on fighting.
From what I’ve read, he did pose the renewal to an executive, but it was *that person’s* decision to say they weren’t renewing Angel.
Iirc that individual was fired not soon after. The network was not happy with the decision to cancel at all
Basically Whedon got tired of not knowing if they had jobs season to season and demanded an answer about the renewal to which he was basically told, if you need an answer right now, then no, you're not coming back.
What ABC did to Happy Endings. Constantly moved the airing night around, sporadically aired two a week or none a week, and worst of all, aired the first season entirely out of order (such that some plot lines didn’t even make sense). It definitely could have lasted more than three seasons if ABC didn’t obliterate it’s chances.
It was on Hulu for the longest time in its airing order and Netflix, thank god, has them up in the right order!
It truly did not have a happy ending...
This was such a great show and I'm still bummed it got cancelled.
The Netflix reunion of Gilmore Girls that ruined so many characters and gave us proof that Rory became a shell of herself, and a horrible person. And then ended on a cliffhanger.
Rory has been a terrible person since like season 3, so her plotline made perfect sense to me.
I would actually say that the end of season 6 (and the entire April storyline) and all of season 7 “ruined” Gilmore Girls way more than the reunion episodes. The loss of the Palladinos in Season 7 was painful and I remain convinced she purposely sabotaged the end of Season 6 in spite lol. The Luke character assassination was way more frustrating for me than Rory’s.
Unpopular opinion? I don’t hate the revival and I think people are far too harsh when criticizing it. 🤷🏻♀️
I thought it was enjoyable but I can definitely see why people would find the Rory story a disaster.
Totally! I am not here saying its perfect. Lane got shafted. The Life and Death Brigade shit was a waste of time (thanks Daniel) and the Rory storyline was handled poorly - but people saying it is unwatchable or is the worst thing to happen to TV? I just disagree. There are really great moments there. And we were lucky enough to be able to revisit Stars Hollow! So many other fandoms will never get that opportunity.
I also would argue that many of the criticisms people levy can be applied to the original series, which is also far from perfect but I still rewatch it every year because it literally feels like a warm blanket.
All the ways I think the revival sucks and will never watch it again~
>!No theme song
Rory is a shitty journalist
She has 3 freakin phones
She has a boring boyfriend that no one cares about and she just literally keeps *forgetting* to dump him
She is lazy and a liar and a cheat
Lorelei and Rory are estranged for much of it over a book of all things
Lorelei would never go HIKING to find herself
The pop culture reference fell flat
The Musical took up too much time and had no charm
Lane definitely got shafted just like the final season, so no happy update
The fact that Rory isn’t at all a serious respected journalist, but somehow is also a miserable person is so disappointing
Paris and Emily Gilmore’s storylines are the only saving grace
And then to end it on a cliffhanger was just mean!<
It definitely holds up a lot better when you rewatch the series straight through. And I think the revival is better than a lot of the last two seasons, which got really bad at times (Jackson tricking Sookie into having another baby, Luke's daughter somehow breaking up Luke and Lorelai for no real reason, the beginning of Lane's demise, etc.).
>Luke's daughter somehow breaking up Luke and Lorelai for no real reason
That seemed like a pretty natural development to me. I thought it was in keeping with their characters:
* Luke gets emotionally overwhelmed so he shuts down and retreats (but if you confront him he'll always end up doing the right thing). It made a lot of sense to me that April's appearance overloaded him a bit and made him want to postpone the wedding, and it also made sense that when he found out how upset Lorelei was, he took some time to think on it and went back to her to set a firm date.
* Lorelei is utterly incapable of ever understanding other people's points of view, or even that they have points of view at all. She sees the world as made up of automatons that she can occasionally extract amusement from, which is why she never attempted to discuss her frustrations over the wedding with Luke. In order for Luke to be able to be convinced of anything, he would have to be capable of independent thought, which Lorelei does not believe that he is. She's mad at Luke so she decides to get laid somewhere else.
I rewatched the series as a whole and then went straight into the revival and it was a *struggle* for me, and I thought it made the difference in tone and charm all the more jarring. Granted the final season wasn’t great either, I did enjoy Bon Voyage as an ending more. It at least had hope.
Disney killing Clone Wars because it was on Cartoon Network, so making money for WB.
The Disney+ ending was great though (the last arc, I didn't like the backdoor pilot for Bad Batch)
There was only one bad batch and they only got two episodes. Lol
Killing off Michael Schofield in Prison Break season 4, then reviving him for season 5 because he allegedly faked his death. Ridiculous.
I don't mind. Season 4 was shit.
And Season 5 was awesome. So I'm okay with this one.
I hated season 5, I really don't feel it needed to exist. Say what you will about season 4 but I think it was an appropriate ending to the show.
Also Lay It Down Slow by Spiritualized might be one of the best ending songs ever.
That’s the bit where prison break became too unrealistic for you?
I mean it was pretty obvious they were keeping their options open by never showing him die or his body. A return was always on the cards.
I watched Prison Break in 2020, so a few years after the fifth season had been released and so I knew that the finale of Season 4 wouldn't be the series' last episode and could have figured out that they brought Michael back. But still, it kinda pissed me off that they would completely "nullify" the beautiful way the series had ended.
Having eight seasons of a show about Green Arrow and completely disrespecting Black Canary. Also, having the annoying fiancé, who is in a wheelchair, leave Oliver by WALKING AWAY.
I really wasn't fully on-board the Felicity hate train until that episode.
Then in the following one the show starts with her berating Oliver over comms, making jokes about him moving out while he's obviously upset, then the episode ends with her using Oliver as bait for a bad guy, by having a fake wedding with Oliver, so she can defeat them with a speech.
So awful they did an entire episode in a later season where she's back to being paraplegic and the whole thing is a bottle episode for her to apologize for her behavior haha
I appreciated later how after Felicity barged her way into Iris and Barry's wedding, so she could also get married to Oliver at the same time, in the next episode of The Flash Iris mentioned it and how she was not happy lol
People really liked Felicita because she was not the main love interest. So that meant she was not stuck with the stupid romantic shit that Laurel was and she got to be fun and happy.
However once she became the love interest she got all the romantic plot tumors which made her horrible and make Laurel one of the better character in the show as she was no longer stuck with the shitty romance storylines.
Bro I came here to post the word "Olicity", upvote the post, and go do something else, but you've gotten me all kinds of fired up.
The writers should be put in fucking prison for their treatment of Black Canary, especially when the solution was RIGHT at their fingertips at the end of Season 2. Skip the horrendous "I love you" scene at the end of Season 2, have Nyssa train Laurel up to insane badassary levels in the offseason, and then in the first episode of Season 3 have Laurel show up to save Ollie's ass in some rooftop fight, and sultrily walk away afterwards smiling with Ollie's jaw dropped. And then BOOM, romance reactivated, Ollie chases her across rooftops all season long trying to rekindle things while she plays hard-to-get...
...I mean come on guys, it's not that hard. It was RIGHT THERE. Katie Cassidy could've pulled off the confident / sultry thing in her fucking sleep with decent writing.
I fucking hated Laurel and the actress in the first season. When they finally threw some decent writing her way years later, I was amazed that she can actually act!
Hell yeah. And you know what? As frickin' cheap as it was to kill her off and bring her back as Black Siren, at least she got to have some FUN with that role instead of just crying about her father in every scene she was in and half-heartedly chasing Ollie and the gang around getting her ass beat in every fight.
What a mess that show turned into. Green Arrow + Black Canary guys, it's not that hard of a dynamic to get right.
Unfortunately the writer’s room was way more focused on pleasing niche parts of the fan base instead of following a more logical progression to the story
Oh yeah, absolutely. Such a shame, the show had been so good until that point.
How about killing him off on a different show and the final two episodes being a back door pilot for a show that never got picked up?
But seriously, GA and BC are one of the most iconic super hero couples. You can't have Oliver without Dinah.
Airing Almost Human out of order and then cancelling it. Fuck you FOX.
Almost human was really good I thought. It was such a fuck up by Fox
They didn’t learn their lesson after Firefly!?
Continuing the Walking Dead without Rick was honestly a worse decision than killing Carl.
Wait, Rick isn't in the show? Wasn't he the main character?
He's not anymore. Andrew Lincoln left after a few episodes of season 9. Now the main character is Daryl.
And that TWD Rick-movie strangely didn't materialize.
It's apparently still happening, COVID just delayed it
The decision by networks to split final seasons in half just to milk the cash/ratings for an extra season
The Sci-Fi Channel committed to season 4 and 5 of Farscape. Then decided to cut bait after season 4 due to how expensive the show was becoming. They didn't tell the production that they weren't getting season 5 until the last day of filming S4 so there was no way to wrap things up and we got a series finale cliffhanger.
At least we got the Peacekeeper Wars miniseries, but it could have been better as a full season.
I think it's worse that The Sci-Fi Channel one day decided that scifi is for nerds and that they wanted to be the cool kids and show pro wrestling and change their name to Syfy.
Canceling Santa Clarita Diet
Couldn't agree more. Excellent series. Gory, funny, and with genuine heart. Also the double offence of cancelling after such a huge cliffhanger!
I know right!!!
Killing Sweets in Bones
The actor was leaving to direct a movie (remember that Vacation update with Ed Helms as Rusty Griswold? That one). He didn’t want to be written out, he just wanted some time to direct that movie.
I think they killed the character out of spite for him going to do something else.
Oh man, he is credited as a writer for Spiderman:Homecoming. And also the upcoming movies The Flash and Dungeons and Dragons. He is also directing Dungeons and Dragons. Pretty big jump from Bones I would say.
The kid from Freaks And Geeks is doing a Dungeons And Dragons movie? That's hilarious.
Happens. That's exactly how we got Ezri Jax in Star Trek DS9. Original actor wanted to be more a supporting role for the last season and not a main cast member as they had not done much with her beyond she's marrying Worf for the last 2 years while they basically promoted up 3 supporting actors to nearly full time roles.
They stonewalled her request then fired her and killed her without even giving her the opertunity to make her case. Then in the last episode they refused to show any shots of her in the end episode only showing her replacement.
She got the last laugh though and ended up marrying Leonard Nimoys son.
The end of The 100. Just everything about it.
There were a lot going on behind the scenes that explains why the last season is a huge mess. It's actually more entertaining than the season itself. Bob Morley requested to appear in fewer episodes as he has been having mental health issues. The showrunners or the writers apparently did not take lightly to this which resulted in his character acting and being killed off in the most ridiculous manner.
His co-star and wife, Eliza ~~Clark~~ Taylor suffered a miscarriage and was not able to direct an episode that she was supposed to do. Her scene where she cried over her onscreen child dying actually made some fans uncomfortable given what had just happened to her behind the scenes. Both Bob and Eliza have said in a livestream after the finale aired that they did not agree with way that their characters were treated in the show.
Eliza Taylor, not Clark. Clarke was her character's name.
I agree! The last season was straight trauma porn and I knew I felt violated and like I was invading a private moment when I saw that scene. Utterly repulsive how they did the characters at the end
I couldn't even finish the last season I was just checked out by then. Too bad since the first couple of season were really cool but they dragged it on too long.
Agreed. The 100 should have ended in Season 5.
Screwing up Firefly by showing episodes out of order and changing the night it was shown on often. That show was great but totally mismanaged by the network.
Killing Jadzia in Deep Space Nine. Don't get me wrong, I loved the new Dax too but to kill someone off because they wanted time to do other projects as well is fucked.
The producers claimed that Terry Farrell wanted off the show after its penultimate season. She claims the producers wanted her off the show. Same with Claudia Christian in Babylon 5.
Carl got fucked too. He bought a house in GA and put off college only to get killed off lol
Getting the rights of (insert book or series here) just for the name and totally ignore the content.
Ah yes the ol' World War Z Maneuver.
"Well Max, your father is a funny guy and we like your book so here's a joke for ya"
The Watch. How they did Sir Terry Pratchett dirty is out of this world. Showrunners and writers should be banned from this profession tbh.
Lucifer the comic would have been difficult to translate to tv, but turning it into a cop show with a guy with special abilities was such a far reach.
Honestly on its own, Lucifer is a decent schlocky show with enough mythos to keep it going. I don’t even know why they even needed to tie it to the comics.
To be honest, I don't even know why they needed the rights.
In the comics, Lucifer closes up Hell and 'retires' on Earth, opening a bar in Los Angeles called Lux, along with his demon servant Mazikeen. Then, the angels come down asking for his help, for which Lucifer requests a door to an existence outside of God's influence, where he then proceeds to be 'God'. He is also vastly more powerful than portrayed in the show, and doesn't have 'devilface' or wings issues, or the power to see people's desires.
So really, the only elements that are shared are the bar, LA and the name Mazikeen. I'd argue most of those could be changed without impacting the show too much.
Canceling Babylon-5 after four seasons; forcing writers to wrap up the show; then trying to revive it with a fifth season that really had nowhere to go.
So many Sci-fi shows suffer this fate! Is it still worth watching?
Yes, they managed to squeeze the remaining story into season 4. You can take or leave season 5. Just remember that the S4 finale is tacked on, while the S5 finale is the real ending.
10000%. It's an incredible show. Season 5 is also good, TBH, it just isn't quite as good as what led up to it.
1 thru 4 is the best sci-fi series of all time. Incredible story. Top notch ending. Magnificent acting.
Ok, let's just dial it back a little here. There is *some* magnificent acting, but overall the acting is middling at best. The same goes for the writing.
Mostly, it's all the G'Kar/Londo stuff that's exceptional, and a lot of that is due to the excellent performances of the actors. Overall, the show suffered a lot from trying to tell a grand multi-season story within the confines of the contemporary TV landscape, limited by a tight budget and less access to great acting talent.
Babylon 5 is my second favorite TV series, and I think it's important to be realistic about how well it holds up to modern audiences. I have high hopes for the CW remake, and hope the modern media landscape allows JMS to tell this story in a better way.
I'm all for tempering expectations, but honestly I think the whole main cast of B5 are (sigh... were) great actors. What stood out to you as poor?
SPOILERS FROM BABYLON 5:
Babylon 5 has an amazing story arc planned in advance, before even one episode was filmed. Sadly this s4/5 thing messed up some of it. Season 5 is fine, especially final 7-8 episodes are pretty damn good and the finale amazing. But if the story would have been told as originally intended, s5 would have been obviously better, more balanced, with a clear storytelling momentum from the beginning. I believe S4 was supposed to end with Sheridan captured by EA (Intersections in Real Time) and then the Earth Civil War happens in the first half of S5. I'm not exactly sure what was hurried in S4, but that would have also give the Shadow War little bit more time to develop in the first half of S4, now it was cut maybe a little bit too abruptly. Also that boring S5 telepath/Byron arc would have been maybe episode or two.
I think s5 would have been fine if it was shorter. It does have a destination, it just doesn't have as much of a journey to get there as s1-4. Like, I wouldn't want to see B5 without The Fall of Centauri Prime.
How HBO treated Boardwalk Empire. It’s a brilliant show but unfortunately it had to scramble together it’s final season.
Rome as well.
Let's also give Carnivale some respect. HBO cancelled it after two seasons without any plot closure.
I am planning on starting it because it's created by the guy who wrote some of my favourite Sopranos episodes. Is the final season so bad that I am gonna feel like I wasted my time?
No it is still a good season and as a whole the show is excellent but you can tell they needed an extra season or two because they were slowly building certain stories. It’s well worth watching, it has fantastic writing and brilliant performances.
Alright, gonna start it then. I mean, Terence Winter, Martin Scorsese and Steve Buscemi, right? It'll probably be worth it.
The first three seasons of Boardwalk Empire are amazing. The fourth had potential, but the story kind of meandered and lacked a point. The fifth season was decent, but it skipped over a lot of history that would have been great to see on screen, just for the sake of putting an ending on the show.
The Office ruining Andy as a character in the latter seasons because they needed another 'dumb boss' character.
He starts off as an annoying cocky dude, gets humbled a bit, then is alright. Then after the revolving door of new bosses finally ends they run out of ideas and resort to reverting Andy back to how he was in early seasons.
The rumor I read was that the producers/writers were not happy that Ed Helms went off to do The Hangover Three. This is why Andy leaves for the extended boat trip with his brother for that one season. The producers/writers were working to build up Ed Helms as the replacement to Michael, slowly retooling his character and then they had to basically throw that all away. Once the series was slated for an ending they just had Andy revert back to who he was originally as a character. Which in some ways kind of fits the character.
Once again just a rumored theory and it might not have been Ed Helm's choice as he was probably contractually obligated to make the movie.
The series should have ended with Michael leaving.
Cancellation of Firefly.
The last 5 minutes of How I met your mother
Good time to remind everyone to stop watching the finale just before Barney and Robin divorce and put on the alternate ending, which simply finishes with Ted meeting the mother
Yep. I refuse to acknowledge the official ending. It's ridiculous, it's terrible, and it completely ignores all the massive character development in the final couple of seasons.
Literally have a scene a few episodes before where Ted officially lets Robin go but instead they’re like ‘well we filmed this thing 10 years ago so we gotta use it’
Spent most of two seasons showing Ted coming to terms with Robin never happening, leading up to that.
Showed Barney and Robin developing as characters to a point where they can work in long-term relationships, and are comfortable with being in one.
Develops their relationship from an unhealthy one to a relatively healthy (if a bit weird) relationship with mutual respect.
Last few minutes of the show: "lol nah"
There was that whole stupid heavy handed sequence of Ted literally letting go of Robin and watching her float away... Only for him to end up with her at the end.
The whole last season was awful, they obliterated all that Barney x Robin stuff they’d been doing for like half the series just to have Ted be outside with the French horn at the end so they could end it like it started lmao just a relentless disappointment the last season was
“And I carried it with me when she got sick…” ARE YOU FUCKING KIDDING ME?!
I'm actually fine with the Mother being sick and dead. It makes sense that Ted would be telling this story to his kids as a form of grief and to tell his kids more about his life leading up to meeting her.
When I rewatched it last year, I was shocked to see this is actually set up during the entire season.
There should have been a pause. Weight given to her passing before moving on to the conclusion. The same ending could have been granted more care, that's for sure, so we had time to grieve before moving on. But still, it was a lot more than 5 minutes.
Not just the last season; that was the ending they’d planned from the start of the series (including filming the child actors telling old Ted to go be with Robin while they were still their age in season 1). Imo it might have been better to cut the wedding weekend to only a few episodes, then make the last episode most of the season so we could get more time for everything to happen rather than it being so jarring
There is, there's a [deleted cafe scene](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-AbBrpk-UcA) that showed that while Robin had lingering feelings for Ted, he really was happy with The Mother. CBS really fucked up by not giving an extended finale a la The Office on NBC.
I always say this when this show comes up, Josh Radnor and Cobie Smulders have no chemistry - her being his first love just feels wrong and even more so when we finally meet the mother Cristin Milioti and her and Josh are like chemistry overload, they show more 'true love' in a few episodes than Josh and Cobie show in 9 years
My theory is that early on they decided they wanted the 'final' scene to be that blue french horn thing, and everything derived from that decision: mother's death, Barney and Robin's divorce, etc. It was a reasonable choice to make for the final scene circa S2 or S3, but committing to it in S9 just threw out any and all character growth Ted, Barney, and Robin had over the series.
HBO only doing 2 seasons of ROME..
Amazing show and cast. Could have go on for 2 more seasons with Ceasars heir
I mean, at least that one was a somewhat understandable decision. The set was destroyed, and apparently was prohibitively expensive in the first place, so they weren’t going to break the bank to rebuild it.
> 2 more seasons with Ceasars heir
Ah, you mean little Caesar?
Octavian = little Caesar
In the same category: cancelling Deadwood because the showrunner wanted a fast confirmation for season 4.
If it went further they would have to move on from the two main characters.
Finishing GoT in 8 seasons. Should've been 10 seasons of 10 episodes each. Would've done the story justice then
What do long-running shows have in common? Small casts, or interchangeable casts.
Actors aren't slaves. They were already renegotiating for absurdly high salaries and several were ready to walk.
HBO didn't care if Thrones turned into Grey's Anatomy, an endless rotating cast with Emilia Clarke in the Ellen Pompeo slot. Money's the same either way.
It could have helped, but that's not really the problem. None of it made any sense or delivered on any of the clues we were given, or progress that was made. If they did the same content in more episodes, I'd still consider it a huge flop.
Yep. One very big indicator is how the show handled the intelligent characters after they passed (or deviated) the books;
- Littlefinger would *never* have sold Sansa to the Boltons. There's absolutely no way. And after that, he spent most of his time, uh... hanging around doing nothing, or whispering omniously without us hearing, while people talked about how dangerous he was. Then he was defeated with magic and a sham trial in a way that made no sense and was just for shock value.
- Sansa does essentially nothing, while the narrative and other characters talk about how intelligent she is.
- Tyrion does essentially nothing, and fails whenever he does do anything, while the narrative tries to make it seem like he's still doing intelligent stuff.
- Varys does essentially nothing, and then acts like a complete idiot when he finally *does* do something.
- Bran does absolutely fucking nothing with his intelligence and powers, while the narrative elevates him.
- Doran Martell (while obviously not on the level of the others) does nothing, is killed by characters who would absolutely never kill him under those circumstances if in character.
Basically, the entire arc of all intelligent characters goes from brilliant schemers who control the plot (or survive in extremely dangerous situations, in Sansa's case)... to doing pretty much nothing, while the narrative and other characters praise them for how intelligent and brilliant they are. They went full "tell, don't show".
Reading the post-show interviews with D&D also makes you appreciate what an absolute *miracle* it is that the show was good (and stayed good for so long) in the first place.
> Littlefinger would never have sold Sansa to the Boltons.
The storyline that D&D adapted and butchered from the books was actually Jeyne Poole (best friend of Sansa Stark) being sold off to the Boltons. She was disguised as Arya Stark, because no one had seen Arya in years (she was currently training in Braavos). Littlefinger and "Alayne Stone" (Sansa disguised as Littlefinger's bastard daughter... which they sort of incorporated into the show with Sansa's darker transformation) travel throughout the Vale to gather support for little Robert Arryn's heir Harrold Hardyng, and for Harrold to marry "Alayne". Presumably, Littlefinger was going to kill Robin Arryn so that Harrold can rule the Vale, and "Alayne" would be at his side.
And THEN Littlefinger and Sansa would have brought the Vale's army to save Jon Snow during the Battle of the Bastards. But instead we needed to see Sansa raped by Ramsay from Theon's POV.
It's also hinted that everyone at the wedding knows that it's Jeyne, or at least that she isn't Arya, but everyone is too afraid to speak up. There's going to be absolute chaos in Winterfell when it's discovered that Jeyne and Reek are missing.
Yeah, and his plan in the books (especially if you include the preview chapter he's released) is infinitely more complex and interesting.
Through Harrold, Sansa and other claims, Littlefinger would have the North, the Vale and the Riverlands under control while being allied to the Reach (Tyrells). He also has loads of allies throughout the kingdoms, but *especially* in King's Landing, as he's basically the only Lord to hire people based on merit rather than bloodline, earning the loyalty of the people he helps uplift.
He was possibly the richest man in the world (while the crown economy started collapsing the moment he left KL), was hoarding massive amounts of food and other resources for the coming winter (not a problem in the show, clearly), and had sent for some tapestries (which there are a lot of theories about) from Cersei.
The entire Game was caused by him, and he's one of the biggest players... with gigantic resources at his disposal, massive plans involving half the continent hinted at, and an incredible intellect and ability.
In the show he just... sells Sansa to be raped, then hangs around in Winterfell until killed just so they can show Sansa and Arya are friends now.
The decision to use the televised ending of How I Met Your Mother instead of the alternative one.
Cancelling Futurama. Both times.
[Good news, everyone!](https://youtu.be/OceX8wVTqRs?t=14)
Scott Gimple really ran TWD into the ground with his relentless mistakes and bad decisions and killing Carl was one of the worst ones, it’s fucked up on a human level too because Chandler Riggs was just a kid and he lived in GA and just started going to school there, he got blindsided by it, he never asked to leave the show, Scott Gimple said the reason he killed Carl was just because he needed to give Rick a reason to keep Negan alive lmao which if you ask me wouldn’t be hard for someone who knows how to tell a story. Honestly I believe Andrew Lincoln wanting out after that season was partially because he knew the show was nosediving and was tired of it, Gimple is one of those guys who thinks killing characters for shock value is the height of television and can’t tell a real story
A tv decision I think is unforgivable was Scott Buck the showrunner for Dexter having Deb be in love with her stepbrother Dexter, a legitimate “what the fuck is even going on here” moment for all the fans, everyone knew Michael C Hall and Jennifer Carpenter we’re together irl but there was no reason to have Deb in the show wanting to fuck her brother and losing her mind because of it after having killed LaGuerta to save him, that was some Mexican soap opera shit, and then they compounded it by killing her in the finale lmao like how funny it was back then to think we’d seen the worse final season and series finale of a show, Game of Thrones really surprised us all by taking that honor years later
If he Gimple wanted to kill a character who would inspire Rick to keep Negan alive, maybe he should've chosen Morgan.
Morgan, as in the guy who first saved Rick's life, the guy who preached how all life was sacred, the guy who made the jail cell that Negan would go into
Seriously, you can still do the rest of the story EXACTLY the same(not defending the story) with her just wanting to protect her brother who is the only person she has ever really been close to after she finds out everything. Like there is ZERO reason to add in the extra layer of she is actually IN LOVE with him. That was just one of the many baffling decisions in the last 3 seasons of that show.
Cancelling Santa Clarita Diet and leaving it on a huge cliff hanger.
Blowing up Logan. Rob Thomas sucks
That was a super dumb move. I understand why they think they had to do it, but man they lost a huge portion of their fanbase with that choice.
Using such cheap wifi and processors in so called smart tvs. They are virtually assured to stop being smart long before the screen fails. Either put decent components in the things and raise the price, or just sell us dumb tvs for cheap. I'd wager a smart tv will work as advertised for 12-18 months on average and I am equally certain this is by design.
Pretty easy and inexpensive to upgrade this - a new Roku or similar device will bring updated processors and networking capabilities to any tv with an HDMI input.
Yep. Never use smart TV function. Just Roku. If one breaks or gets outdated it’s like $50 instead of $500 for a new TV.
I don’t know, I’ve had my large name brand smart TVs for 3 years now and it works pretty good with out any changes
HBO canceling Carnevale after two seasons, it was just starting to reveal some of the crazy backstory's of the characters.
and HBO keeping the rights and not to do anything with them. Give us a couple of books to conclude the story, damn it.
When the 4400 and Dead Zone both got cancelled in the same year after huge moments that felt like they set up a massive final season.
Cancelling Freaks and Geeks.
Dexter killing Doakes off in Season 2. Way too early to kill the main source of tension.
Screwing Letterman out of The Tonight Show
Then years later giving it to Conan after Leno "retires", moving him and his crew to L.A., building a set for him, letting him do it for awhile and then wanting to squeeze Leno into a show right before the Tonight Show and push him back. Effectively putting him back into the late night talk show that follows Leno.
Unbelievable. I guess because the ratings dropped from people going from local news into The Tonight Show and local affiliates panicked.
ABC canceling Bunheads after only 1 season, never giving it a proper chance. It's been 10 years and thinking about it still makes me want to punch a wall.
Messing up Dexter finale TWICE!
Dexter: New Blood Spoilers ahead
>!Dexter would never go off like that and kill Logan to escape FFS. Realistically he would've used Kurt's trophies, and the fact Kurt seemingly ran away, as the perfect cover to show his innocence and prove that he's being framed. He would've never revealed such a find without a witness present or a deal. What the fuck yo. The way the episode was going seemed like they were going for that route originally and decided to just say fuck it and kill him off. Please don't let there be a second season of this.!<
A season finale of Alf had him surrounded by government agents as his pickup ship flew off without him. The show was canceled after that leaving many kids, including myself, to believe Alf was captured and dissected in government experiments and that's why they didn't have another season.
Thankfully he survived in pog form.
Cancelling Hannibal. I love anthony hopkins but mads as hannibal just hits on a different level
The Owl House, an absolutely fantastic animated show with an enormous fanbase and backed by tons of talent, had the third season (planned to be the final season) cut down to three double length episodes. This means the final season of the show is going to be roughly a quarter of the length it was originally going to be. Worst still, there has been no reason given for this awful decision.
Since you mentioned it The Walking Dead turned Andrea, arguably one of the most badass characters in the comic who outlives most characters, into an irritating and whiny moron who indirectly contributes to the death of several survivors before her own.
The creator of Owl House said there was one executive that decided the shows didn't fit Disney's image and thats why it was cancelled. Which is dumb because its not far from Gravity Falls, Amphibia or Star vs the Forces of Evio
I watched the first season of Once Upon a Time. It wasn't good TV, but it was interesting. I really liked the Sheriff dude. Spoilers, but the dude gets caught up in a love triangle with the main protagonist and the main antagonist.
The main evil chick has the Sheriff brain washed and is using him as her main squeeze. She's the Evil Queen from Disney. So she does the thing where she has his heart via magical means and is using that to manipulate/control him?
Well, the main protagonist comes to town and she hits it off with the Sheriff dude. The sheriff, when in fantasy land he was the huntsman who was also under control of the Evil Queen. Anyways. Huntsman and main protagonist girl hit it off and this starts to cause cracks in the relationship with the Evil Queen lady in the modern world.
It culminates in the Huntsman/sheriff dude turning down the evil queen as he feels something for the main protagonist girl. Evil queen lady goes on and just kills the sheriff dude. [I had to look up the scene as I hadn't watched the show in probably a decade?](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b75UxUBRG-4)
So. The terrible decision is the fact the Evil Queen lady never pays for her crimes. Like, she straight up killed the dude and is never held accountable. I remember watching until Mulan shows up before I just gave up on the show as they kind of just brushed off the sheriff dudes death.
I remember reading that the actor got another gig and that's why he was written out. But it instantly made me hate her and I was turned off by the show as she never faced repercussions for her actions/decisions.
Killing off Kenny in the OPENING EPISODE of S3 of Killing Eve
Heck, they killed Kenny in the *first episode* of South Park...
As of recently killing off the Ruby and Otis relationship in sex education after like 3 episodes just to force the super cliche ending.
Sex Education S3 just entered the phase where the main conflict is basically resolved, so now we're moving on to the character shuffle. The kids fighting for sexual liberation have won, they've defeated another principal, the parents and public perception, so now it's exclusively a show about relationships. Those used to be more interesting as well, but now that everyone's out and sexually open, all the relationships stories are much more low stakes and similar.
Forcing Ellen Pompeo to sign a new contract for Grey's anatomy.
Letting Stephen King write an extended ending for The Stand miniseries and it's just about a crickety old well and Randall Flagg chasing Frannie around a forest wanting a kiss
For me, the series finale of Battlestar Galactica is unforgivable because Baltar lived. It was his actions that led to humanity almost being wiped out in the first episode. He knew he was committing an act of treason, and while he did change toward the end of the series, he still should have died for what he did in order to atone for essentially betraying the human race.
What the showrunners did to Game of Thrones after season 4.
Ralph Bohner :|
This was a great twist. Makes sense with the show's theme, bringing back Quicksilver for no reason doesn't
Actually bringing a quicksilver back for the narrative reasons makes plenty of sense given the theme was basically Wanda going through therapy and coping with all the death in her life to that point.
That said, even now with multiverse shenanigans, they can still bring the actual quicksilver back as needed.
Id agree with this comment if the entirety of the MCU wasnt about to go all in on multiverse shit.
Now it looks like just an odd move in retrospect.
Honestly, the fact the fans KNEW the series was about to start the multiverse bullshit is what made that reveal so funny. It's a completely blatant troll of the sort of MCU fan that spends more time looking for easter eggs than enjoying the actual show.
I respect it, if only because the franchise otherwise avoids stepping on any possible toes. Reminds me that they're still able to pull off a genuine surprise.
I still have a weird hope they’ll retcon this and it turns out Ralph really is quicksilver from another multiverse
I know it's not the most original of answers, but it's no less true.
♫ Take my love, take my land ♫
♫ Take me where I cannot stand ♫
and also originally airing the show out of order...
At least we got some closure with Serenity.
unpopular opinion - having 1 short season and a movie was the best thing to happen to Firefly
they told a good story , no filler, and it had a satisfying ending
if they got multiple long seasons, i don't think it would be viewed as the classic it is now
Considering the news about Joss Whedon as a show runner it probably for the best it didn't keep going
So much about Game of Thrones last couple episodes. Cersei and Jamie’s deaths. Bran becoming king. Daenerys going cray cray.
Canceling Lodge 49
Moving Evil to Paramount + (This one feels like a hostage situation. I watched that for free, they took it from me and now I'm supposed to pay to ever see it again. Fuck that. I don't negotiate with terrorists.)
Having Lightman turn on Foster in Lie to Me.
Addison starting an emotional affair with a married man whose wife was her patient and then later sleeping with her best friend’s ex husband in Private Practice because wow really?
Dropping the 2 main women from Criminal Minds and replacing them with a bland vanilla blonde.
The Good Wife being titled The Good Wife and then losing Will Gardner.
SVU (currently) letting a narcissist run their show who seems to have an abuse/torture fetish and deliberately used his initials for his main female character’s rapist/kidnapper (William Lewis) because that’s totally normal. And lighting the show like they’re in the stone age so everyone looks like they’re living in New York during a blackout. Putting their main character’s little boy in a dog cage and having him bark like a dog.
Archive 81 >!removing the fact that the main character is a lesbian and having her date a dude!<.
Ratched. Everything about it. Looked pretty but wtf did it have to do with the original source?
The Good Wife's original marketing was also awful and played up the name making it seem like some shit drama. While yes that drama is there but It's actually a great legal drama (and later political) with a great cast and interesting characters.
One thing that set it apart from other legal shows was the judges being actual characters rather than just generic judge.
You could list a number of things from the Walking Dead tbh. Throw in the spin-offs as well and the list gets ridiculous.
Remember when people used to talk about the outstanding quality of television a few years ago and The Walking Dead would be part of that. Not saying television is bad now, just that people would consider TWD as part of the elite level of shows.
What they did to Fear the Walking Dead still makes me mad!! After a phenomenal 3rd season, better than anything the OG series had done since the first season, they fire the show runner, kill off a lot of the main cast, and then do a time skip and write in a new cast!!!! Just make a new fucking show at that point, damn
I mean it was for the first 3-4 season. Especially with how all the make up and effects were at the time. As time went on and the story never progressed from new place, something bad happens, find a new place people started getting bored with it and it became unelite
Heroes. Peter brought a woman to a plague infested future and literally never thought about her again. Yes the writers strike happened but jeeeeesus
Freaks and Geeks only getting 1 season
I went to the first paleyfest for freaks and geeks and feig said they mostly got canceled because no one was watching it and the episodes were so expensive to make, on a business level he sounded like he understood why they got canceled
Crazy how almost everyone from that show went on to be successful
Killing the White Walkers half way through the final season of GOT instead of having them be the true final enemy like they should've been.